Bedtime Trader review
Find out if this forex technique really lives up to the hype
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44 comments
Julian Horridge
I tried this system a couple of years ago. I think it was fairly new at the time. Followed the advice for newbies to trade on Major pairings. Not one pairing came up in this category within the trial period, only Minor pairings. I did spend about two weeks of the 60 day trial period to figure out how to use it as advised. So I sent it back close to the 60 day period allowed. I then suspect I was put on a blacklist by Agora. I can,t be certain, of that. Just a feeling that I got later. I found the experience a little off putting overall to say the least.
Kev
Here is a copy of an e-mail from a guy I sent my btt analysis to.
Hi Kev back to London on train working the weekend. V sad as tomorrow is my birthday but it’s for a good cause. Good news is that yesterday and today’s trades are going well, I may put fairly right stops on them now and take profit that way or let them run. I may let eurjpn run anyway with a larger stop. So looming lime or will be 10 winning trades out of 11 which is impressive. I checked history and realised I did take gbpnok I must have put a take profit as it had closed at 150 pip profit before I checked. So happy with that and getting faith that this can work. I think what you have done to identify poor btt trades is excellent. Apologies i have not been on skype much hoping it will settle down soon. Winning trades helps. I may venture to increase my stakes next week.
Cheers
Pete
Seems to be working
Darin
Hmmm, Interesting. Thanks Kev. Maybe you should market your results as an addendum to the system….Although I’ve cancelled my sub now it may improve the results for all others also.
Kev
I have back tested BTT until Dec 2011 and it is very clear that the indicators work on some pairings and not on others. In fact, on some pairings trading against the indicator gave a very good profit.
Overall there are about 40 of the pairings you should not trade as over the period back tested there you would lose and at best they would give a small profit, not worth the risk to reward.
I must add that this back testing took me many 100’s of hours but I believe now gives me a good foundation for future trades.
Just another quick point, when I back tested I also looked at letting the trades run for one week and longer. The results on some pairing were amazing with some pairings winning 1000’s of pips over the test period.
If interested look at the GBP/PLN pairing for as a good pairing for the 24 hour period and run on’s.
Tony
I ran with this for four months. Being cautious I had a bank of only £300 and went with “Valid” pairings where the loss was no more then 5% of my bank. I also went with those parings with a low spread. For me it has failed miserably and so far I have lost the £300 although I did get a “refund” of £200 from the spreadbetting company. Maybe if I had played with more money and higher stakes I might have done better but from my point of view its not a case of from little acorns, oak trees grow.
Michael
Mark,
Yes, I bought Bedtime Trader (BTT) but returned it within the trial period.
I think the principle is great – analysis of 100+ currencies within a few seconds, identifying gravestones and dragonflies etc, charts worked well and GFX very good. However, after a week or so, I realised that you had to have such a huge account to make any serious money under the ‘trading rules’ – especially on the ‘exotics’, massive spreads and resulting massive stops. It’s been sometime since I used/returned it so my recollection is somewhat hazy but I dont think that the win/loss ratio was very good either, I do recall loosing money during the trial period.
It may be a good strategy (I dont think so) but I cannot agree to the account size needed to make serious money and as a full time trader I need serious money.
Hope this makes sense and helps.
Best Regards
Michael
Keith
I bought Bedtime trader just over a year ago and traded it as per the signals at 11pm. Almost every week I lost money and every week I would read the weekly summation by posted by Keith about how many pips profit they had made. I thought it must be because I’m being cautious and not taking the higher risk trades so I decided to give the higher risk trades a go – higher losses resulted. I continued for a few months longer eventually losing several hundred pounds all the while continually reading about all these supposed gains that were being made by others, eventually I came to my senses and stopped trading the system.
I guess it will come as no surprise that I haven’t continued my subscription this year.
Ray
I purchased this some time ago, but lost interest (perhaps too soon!) with all the masses of pairs that are quite untradeable due to their high spreads. I have since paired it right down to only sensible pairs, but am stil unhappy with opening large trades just on the presence of a doji. To my mind, this seems over-simplistic, and it seems that performance experienced (or lack of it) by others bears this out.
If they want more money now to continue using it, I will steer very cleer!
Alf
I purchased Bedtime Trader 12 months ago had no trouble opening an account with GKFX and the system seemed to work OK But I have only practise traded and most of the trades have shown a loss on my sheets so have not had the courage to place beds for real and now they want another £94.00 for me to carry on for another year ??? The question is Would it be worth it
Merv
Tried BTT for a number of weeks. Returned it during the trial period for a refund as it did not deliver as expected. PRO’s: Training materials are good (manuals & DVD’s) True set & forget system. Software (signals etc) are good. BTT does work but, most of my gains were wiped out by a negative trade which had both a large stop and spread.
CON’s: Email support can be iffy (I think due to the high up-take levels at the time I purchased). Risk / Rewards ratio is not good. Stop levels can be high. Some spreads can be very large. In order to make progress you need to accept high risk levels.
A. Miller
Hi
I purchased BTT about three months ago but I have not activated it as yet by opening a live GFX account. However, what disturbs me is the monthly cost of this system after the 60 day trial is over. I am more than miffed to have not been informed of this extra cost before purchase.
Please be so kind as to inform me of this extra cost.
Regards
Anthony Miller MBA
16/03/14 – 21:26
Margy
I have tried this system twice, when it originally came out but I couldn’t get on with it and again with the new software I thought I’d try again. Still didn’t find it to be very good lots of maybe signals, too many exotics that were too expensive, very poor support and slow replies to my emails. The few trades I did take gave a very average performance so it’s a thumbs down for me, sorry folks
Mark Murray
Tried Bedtime trader in January had a loss on every Trade I’ve yet to find a system that works yet still pressing on though.
John
I used this system some months ago, but had to return it for a refund as it was not profitable for me. I followed the manual but I often had losers, however when some of these trades were reviewed in the emails etc, some were classified as winners, and winners were sometimes exaggerated. It was as some other reports here, quite annoying to be told you could have won all these pips had you stayed in the trade longer, whereas I had exited as per the manual.
DB
I’ve tried both the original version and the new software based one. I had to email Kevin for clarification and just got a “read the manual” response. I had read it and it wasn’t clear – which is why I asked for help. For the price of the product the support was terrible.
As for results, I was 79.8 points up at the end of the 60 day trial. That could easily have been negative given the size of the stops use.
I returned the product for a refund for 3 reasons:
1. it was barely profitable over 60 days
2. The risk for some of the trades was massive, with no clear risk/reward ratio
3. The support you get for an expensive product was laughable
DB
Jeffrey
I used BTT briefly but it did not live up to expectations. Luckily there is not usually a problem getting an Agora refund, which I did. I usually set out in advance how I am going to trade, paper or real, and my stake which I stick to. I plan to test a strategy for most of the trial period and set a calendar reminder to return it if I am not satisfied. I suppose that I could simply have had tested during a bad patch, but that’s a risk I can’t alter. If it doesn’t perform within the refund period (this period is completely within the control of the seller) then back it goes.
Sandy
I have been trading BTT for some time with a relatively small bank. I’ve always found Kevin and Janet to be prompt in replying to queries. The system is easy to use and the software has been improved continually so that’s it’s now very quick to check for trades, at 11pm at night.
There are many times when trades with massive stop losses are flagged up. I’m looking at the report for w/e 1st Feb. There are 5 trades with stop losses over 1000 pips and a further 5 with SL’s ranging between 500 and 1000. The report said there were 10,700 pips profit on offer. If you didn’t trade these large stop losses, you would have made 579 pips. But of those 579 pips, 391 were made on trades that were flagged up on the preceding Friday, which is against the initial BTT rules. So the best I could have done was 188 pips.
I’ve always found the reporting to be accurate, but the interpretation of some trades invariably lets me down. For example, a trade could be rejected if it was at an all time high or low, which makes sense retrospectively, but after 11pm I’m just not that sharp to notice. Sometimes trades are left to run for an extra day or 2 which is not within the rules.
I’ve had some good weeks and some disappointments, but overall I’m probably about break even, excluding the monthly cost of the system.
I feel I have been trading too many systems, 4 in total and decided earlier this week to cut this down to 2. I’m sticking with the one outright winner and another system that shows promise, so unfortunately BTT is dropped. I’ve asked Kevin a couple of times if he has considered making this a copycat system – I think it’s called Master/Slave – as I’m sure BTT would be excellent for it. So far he hasn’t said if it’s something he’d do.
Will
Hi Sandy, you you mind telling me what two systems are showing promise please. Thank you.
olc
I got his software in Dec 13 and was trying it out as per his instruction but found that most of the trades was “lending” to the broker as he Kevin like’s to call it, I know Dec was a bad month for this system and as I also work overseas most of the time the 1030-1100 pm is normally 1 to 3 AM for me so I had to send his system back within the period required for the refund. I,m sure the system work if you can use it at the late evening and be familiar with it
Alan Tan
I bought BTT sometime Xmas 2013 and it then
Only works on gkfx spread-bet platform, none other.
As I am NOT a UK resident, I couldn’t open up
A spread bet account due to UK laws.
BTT should state these conditions before we waste
Our time. Till today , I am not even sure if I have
Got back my refund. Still waiting for my latest statemfnt
Darin
Also re my ‘anomalies’ comment on Feb 11th. Kevin has since been in contact and these have all been cleared up. Good stuff.
And it would be fair to say that the system is gradually making more sense to me as I use it regularly.
Darin
Well after a couple of weeks of hassles with MT4 updates messing with the BTT signal indicator, that now seems to be fixed and I am now hoping to get back to some regular trading. I have to say the team at BTT have really been on the ball in dealing with these issues which is great to see. It gives a real sense of confidence that you’re not left to fend for yourself.
Also I had three modest winners so that’s always a good way to finish a week!
Ian
Hi Darin
I am interested in your issues with MT4 updates. I normally ignore them, preferring to leave things as they are. Did your issues come after you accepted updates in the platform?
Ian
Darin
Hi Ian, Re MT4 upgrades. I definitely had issues with system before the upgrades. So much so that I almost gave up on it just because of that. MT4 apparently upgraded their software a few weeks ago and that essentially stopped the BTT signal from operating. so there were a couple of weeks of upgrades to BTT until they caught up again. Now the system works better for me than it ever has before in terms of speedy chart updates etc.( This wasn’t the case before). There is also an upgrade to the chart scanning which makes it a very quick task to check potential trades each day. The team were very on the ball in getting that organised also which was great.
BTW thanks for sharing your experience with BTT. It’s helped me to look at where it’s going right or wrong for me also. I agree with several of the comments here re the ‘interpretation of trades’ etc and where they are closed etc. I still have some issues with how the results are reported. Essentially I’m at a point where I’ll be due to renew my subscription in a couple of months. If the performance doesn’t improve and become more consistent I’ll stop using it. I’ve set myself a modest target of 100 pips/weeks averaged over a calendar month trading just the majors/others. I’m leaving out the big exotic stuff. Doesn’t seem too much to ask I think…. We’ll see.
Frank Hemsley
Hi all,
I’ve just seen the comments posted here.
First, I’m surprised that people have not had replies to. We (either Kevin Greenhall or Agora staff) aim to reply to individual queries within 48 hours if the question is not covered in the FAQs on the members’ site, which very often they are.
So please, if you have unanswered questions, do send them in again.
As for results, in his weekly update Kevin reports the points that could have been made on valid trades and possible trades with larger stops. Occasionally there are discrepancies with what users see compared to what is in the report. This usually comes down to interpretation of whether a trade is valid and should be entered. Kevin is very transparent in his weekly report about which trades were valid/not activated and why.
Thanks for the feedback.
regards,
Frank Hemsley
Agora
Darin
Well not a good start. Most of my trades went backwards, although the weekly report indicated that some of the ones I scored a loss on actually went into profit. I couldn’t figure out how this was so……..There were also series of other anomalies that I’m not prepared to comment on at this point.
It’s also obvious that to effectively trade this system you can’t just rely on the signal, Careful checking also needs to be carried out.
But it’s the other anomalies that bother me………
Mark Rose
Any feedback from traders who are actually using this system would be really helpful. (I know there are absolutely loads of you out there!) How are you getting on? Are you matching the posted results?
Ian
Hi Mark I have been using BTT for over a year, and basically it does what it says.It identifies definite trading signals and those that are “nearly” there. I made the mistake of trading many of the “possible” trades at first. I took a break and started trading again in 2014 just following the verified trades and they have made me a nice profit in 2014 to date.
Too many comments above from people who haven’t followed the manual properly. It says not to trade pairs with large spreads and to use small stakes per pip when you start out. It also says you should verify the trade is good by reading the chart yourself before entering the trade. That is all good advice which if followed should ensure you avoid the losing trades. I no longer compare my results to the “official” results as I don’t worry about trades I missed, there are always more to come. As a beginner I did, to see where I went wrong. That is more important than patting yourself on the back for your winners. I don’t always let my trades run the full 24 hours, preferring to cash in a decent profit during the day if I am able to do so, ie near my computer. That may not be in line with the manual but as always it is a personal choice. I also move up my stop loss to lock in a profit during the day rather than wait to see if the tide turned and my profit swung round to be a loss, again, my own choice.
It is easy to use, and I have had excellent support from both Kevin and Agora, as well as from GKFX.
Darin
I’ve had this system for some months, and due to other factors I’ve only really started trading it in earnest from January. I’ll add some comments when I know how it’s going. I’d also be happy to hear from some other users of BTT out there. How are you getting on? I really want this to work but so far it’s been a bit up and down.
Lee
Bought the software this morning but cancelled my order straight away after reading all the feedback and reviews.
Les
Thanks for the comments. I now know not to buy it.
George
Traded this for five months and still not breaking even. ‘Customer service’ is shockingly bad. Kevin does not give a toss. Another scamming system seller -AVOID AT ALL COSTS!!! Kevin, you should be bloody ashamed of yourself. I am going to do my best to get you on BBC Rogue Traders.
Peter
Trading since June down £-364 at 10p per pip stopped trading now. George you are so right Bedtime Trader is a total scam. I’ve had no reply to several E- mails to Kevin Greenhall, his weekly reports are fictitious and weeks that include heavy losses theres no report at all. ie 16-12-13 losses -3,062 IN ONE DAY!! not reported. I’ve lost my money now so please Mark could you warn your readers so they do not do the same.
pjt
I think you havent even tried or even signed up to kevins system of bedtime trading!!! have you George? As you would not make such a statement ref The BBC ? To all who have read your slander” i would ask them to look at Money Market Reviews, that is far better than rouge traders BBC Program and is respected world wide! It is the likes of you that make the public doubt a system that truly works and gives results! as check out the money market webb site! pjt
Sam
I have been following BTT for 9 months and trading it for about three. The 9 months of paper trading were very good – I followed the signals and checked the results. HOWEVER, the three months of real trading were a very different matter. I am about break even after three months of following the trades religiously. I just cannot agree with the published results, which flatter the real returns. The given results assume that the winning trades are taken and exited at optimum times and prices, whereas in reality, it isn’t the same. The high return trades require huge stop losses, so the pips figures are misleading. Support was patronising.
Mark Rose
Hi Sam,
Are you placing a stop loss and profit limit on the trades?
I’m just wondering why it is that the published results vary. Is there a set format to use for placing your stops and limits?
Regards,
Mark
Kieron
If you have to join a specific platform and have specific software for a “system” to work it is not worth the paper it is written on!!!
Certain candlestick paterns occur every day on every chart on every timeframe…thats all you need to get ahead…identify a successful pattern and trade on it!!! You have to be able to sit at the screen but 10 pips a day is easily achievable.Don’t be buying the “latest system”…go to work on yourselves and your psychology etc. Make screenshots every day and study them….the answer to pips will be staring you in the face…good luck
Rex Bonnett
I had terrible trouble installing the platform, & Kevin tried every thing for a week, before giving up! He suggested consulting the
programme designer, who came up, after reading my Emails, forwarded by Kevin to him; with the assurance that he could no doubt instal it for a hourly fee of £40, & IT HAD NEVER TAKEN HIM MORE THAN AN HOUR SO FAR?! As I never OK an open cheque, I suggested on his past performance, that I would pay a £ 50 fee to have it installed! This offer was declined, which I think speaks volumes ! Having now reached an impasse, I approached GKFX for help, & they installed the programme in mins !! I dealt with Kevin by clicking “reply ” to one of his, & I think the problem of no reply, stems from Kevin mistakenly going thro` Agora, Who have a terrible record of automatedly replying in mins, & you never EVER hear anything further for the follow up.The alternative is to phone,at a huge expense, waiting in a queue for along period, to resolve your query -hopefully?? I advised Kevin of this fact & suggested, he did what other systems do, Like B T B, where they have a direct contact E-mail, & reply helpfully in a few minutes! Kevin has not instituted this suggestion?! I have cerainly not recovered the purchase price of the system, in the trial period, & having begun in a “barren ” period have lost money, but hopefully to recoup it by carrying on!? A dissadvantage is that you require an enormous fund, to trade all tips, as some of the stops give a potential loss of over 500 pips ! Having missed out on a large proportion of my trial period, I am carrying on to see if it will make a profit ?!
Ian
When I read the BTT manual it I found that it advised me to skip the trades on pairs where the spread ( the difference between the buying and selling price) is large, that is where the trading platforms make their commission. These will be where you have seen huge points at risk if you follow that trade. I only trade on the pairs with the spread at or under 20 pips. The manual also advises new starters to place trades at small stakes , like 10 p per pip. At those stakes and ignoring the big spread pairs you will not need an “enormous fund” as you put it. I started with just £200 in my GKFX account.
The manual also advises you to not try placing too many trades at once. I have changed the background colour on the charts with large spreads, colour coding them so that I can instantly spot pairs I am not interested in and others that I might look at with caution. This enables me to very quickly pass through the charts to pick out the trades I am interested in making.
Mark Rose
Hi Ian,
Thanks for adding your comments.
Changing the background colour is a very good idea.
Regards,
Mark
Cath
I like BTT. I only trade the majors, but getting a consistent steady results from a small starting pot. There’s no emotion, I simply follow the signals, apply the standard money management rules and leave the trades alone for 24 hours! Some days there’s so many potential trades it’s hard to decide which ones to proceed with. So I agree with the point about steering well clear of the exotics until comfortable with the majors.
valtr
Support is terrible lots of emails and really no help at all,no mention that if you cannot open a GKFX account the software that lets you know about a trade or potential trade will not work.Problems with the charts not loading up when the software is installed asked for help by email still waiting,over a week now!!The system might be working well but with out any support not much help .
It has been over 3 weeks that I emailed and have received very little help in figuring out how to be able to work something out.Kevin is on his boat so support well there is a lack of that.
Laurie
Kevin provided a couple of videos on how to spot and decide on a trade….they were hugely beneficial.
This past week I’ve netted 170 pips….it makes a change for me to get good results trading, but I feel happy with this system and it doesn’t take too much time each evening. It is set and forget which is my preferred method and takes the emotion out of trading. Mark, you made a good point re the more exotic spreads..they can be astronomical and need to be avoided in the early days…I’m still avoiding them….However, there are usually less expensive options available. Kevin’s support is excellent and all in all, a very comprehensive and workable package.
Felix
Hi Laurie,
Not sure whether Kevin’s support is good or not as I bought his product only recently but sent him a no.of emails but never get any follow-up replies. Received his first newsletter (week ending 26 May) but till today on 6 June still waiting for an update….is his newsletter come weekly?